kate_nepveu: sleeping cat carved in brown wood (wood cat)Kate ([personal profile] kate_nepveu) wrote,
@ 2011-04-21 06:06 pm UTC
Entry tags:fanfic, race, rants, tv

So one of the things I want to talk about at the WisCon "Fanfic 401" panel is marginalization of non-white characters; my principal recent example is Yusuf and Saito from Inception. [*]

And that reminds me of my response to Hawaii Five-0, specifically the fannish reaction that I've seen. I have not seen a single episode of this, though I have heard the occasional thing that makes it sound like I might like it. But, here's the thing, the principal cast consists of four people, as shown in this ridiculous promo image:

principal cast of Hawaii Five-0

I see some fannish activity about this show from people who I keep an eye on for their fic in other fandoms. I will give you three guesses as to which two characters I see 99.95% of the energy focused on; the first two don't count.

And maybe that's not a reflection on the show (remember, haven't seen it). Maybe I'm getting a skewed view of the fandom from the random bits I happen to see. But I truly cannot motivate myself to watch this show where every goddamn reference to it makes me say to myself, "Seriously, fandom? Four team members and you pick the two white guys again?!"

(And, I admit, this isn't helped by one of them being Scott Caan (far right), because, seriously?)

Before commenting, please note: as the title says, I am ranting. If you can honestly tell me that the fandom isn't actually all about the white guys (hell, I won't even demand 50%, just a sizable chunk), go ahead and show your work. But I really don't want to hear explanations, justifications, or defenses. You, personally, reading this? Your reasons for being interested in one character/relationship more than another are your own, they're for you to be happy with or not, and I'm not going to give you a gold star or the Magical Minority Fairy seal of approval or whatever, so please keep them to yourself. I'm talking about my own reaction to the apparent aggregate fannish reaction, which is: very tired.

[*] Sadly Sherlock has only one non-white character in its principal cast, and she is not only nasty but gets slut-shamed (well done, show!), so I cannot justly blame her marginalization in fic on fandom alone. (Note, however, that I have not seen that many fics attempting to reclaim her character.) Leverage fandom, at least back when I read it, might be a little bit better about this—Hardison being a geek helps—though I continue to look very side-eyed at the prevalence of Eliot/Nate in this regard. Of course my principal comparison, as the main post suggests, is SGA . . . and that is a topic that will not fit in the bounds of this footnote.



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mkozlows: (idol)


[personal profile] mkozlows
2011-04-21 10:11 pm UTC (link)
My actual prediction before reading the rest of your post was "Well, obviously Daniel Dae-Kim because everyone loves him from Lost and Angel, and then not sure which of the others."

I think Hawaii Five-O is supposed to be really stupid, though, isn't it? It's never gotten on my radar as potentially good at all.

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coffeeandink: (experiment 626)


[personal profile] coffeeandink
2011-04-21 10:25 pm UTC (link)
... Up until this post I was assuming that the Big Slash Pairing in H50 was Daniel Dae Kim/Alex O'Laughlin. Now that I have looked up the cast in IMDB I see that this is indeed Not So.

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rachelmanija: (Blog Against Racism: Sakura)


[personal profile] rachelmanija
2011-04-21 11:06 pm UTC (link)
I haven't seen H50, but the apparent lack of Cobb/Saito is an excellent example of what you're talking about. There's a movie with a potential pairing that involves initial antagonism followed by ANGST and SACRIFICE and I WILL SAVE YOU NO MATTER WHAT... and it's almost entirely overlooked in favor of shipping two white guys whose onscreen interaction mostly consists of being in the same place at the same time.

ETA: Okay, so Steve and Danny are the white dudes, and Chin is Daniel Dae Kim.

From A03:

Steve/Danny: 683 works.

Chin/Steve: 8 works.

Chin/Danny: 7 works.

WOW.



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dragovianknight: A small kitten draped in green yarn (Knitting - Kitten & yarn)


[personal profile] dragovianknight
2011-04-21 11:10 pm UTC (link)
My fannish observation supports Steve/Danny as the dominant (only) pairing, which I can't fathom, because UGH. Why would you write about the two scruffy-ass guys when the universe has handed you Daniel Dae Kim?

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merhawk: Icon made by Hawk (Kidding)


[personal profile] merhawk
2011-04-21 11:19 pm UTC (link)
*blink* Really? If you go just by looks[1], I don't see how there's any slash in this fandom. Daniel Dae Kim rocks the top of the list with those cheekbones. Grace Park wouldn't be that far behind him. Alex O'Loughlin isn't too bad, but that last guy? A distant, distant, fourth.

Friend of mine is into 5-0. She hasn't posted any fic (yet!), but the way she was commenting led me to think that she'd be a Kelly/McGarrett ficcer.

Personally, I've never seen the show.

[1]In my experience, at least half of media fandom goes off of looks. Even when the media was originally a book, the fannish activity changes direction as soon as they see who "the pretty" (for various values) is on the screen.

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kass: Chin Ho from Hawaii 5-0 (Chin)


[personal profile] kass
2011-04-21 11:20 pm UTC (link)
You're not wrong about the fannish activity, at least as far as my experience indicates.

I had imagined before watching any of the show that there might be some tasty het fic featuring Daniel Dae Kim's character and Grace Park's character, but the show cast them as cousins, which largely scotches that. Though I've seen a few stories which posit them as cousins by marriage and not actually related, which seems to free people up to pair them with abandon.

I think there are actually some interesting comparisons to be made between H50 and SGA; both shows play with genre tropes, both shows feature a four-person team where it's easy to read the team as a kind of surrogate family for all parties involved. And yes, as you say, in both cases a sizeable chunk of the fandom has largely glommed on to the two white guys. In ways both awesome and less-awesome, I feel like H50 fits into the fannish space in my heart which went vacant when SGA went off the air.

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[personal profile] mariness
2011-04-21 11:24 pm UTC (link)
...wait, it's not Daniel Dae-Kim?

Huh.

I don't actually follow either fandom or this show, but I would have expected that he would generate more interest, just because he already had a fanbase from Lost. Also, on the excessively shallow note, I figured someone would want to explain that unnaturally perfect skin.

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[identity profile] cakmpls.livejournal.com
2011-04-21 11:25 pm UTC (link)
I'm not a fanfic reader, but if that's the slash pairing, those people are seriously misguided. As someone else says, when you can have Daniel Dae Kim?

But the characters played by Kim and Grace Park do get quite a bit of time in the show itself, including getting to kick some serious butt. And I find those two characters written as less one-dimensional than Danno and Steve.

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[personal profile] ceara
2011-04-22 01:02 am UTC (link)
I've been a fan of Daniel Dae-Kim since he was on Angel, and the way that promo shot is set up tells me that he and Grace Park are the ones the shot-framers thought were the Big Draw. Also they're prettier than the other two, though admittedly I've never seen either of those guys before.

But that's the sum total of my knowledge of the whole issue.

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cofax7: Angel Dunnett Slashy (AtS - Seduce Men -- Infinitemonkeys)


[personal profile] cofax7
2011-04-22 01:15 am UTC (link)
The half-an-episode I've seen (I was at my mother's house and it gave her something to do) indicates that it's not only the fans who spend all their energy writing about the two white guys. What little critical commentary I've seen also indicates that this is a pattern in the show: Park and Kim's roles are to provide support and information for the two white guys, and they get relatively little agency or character development. It's possible I'm misinterpreting the data, of course.

People I like love the show and the white-guy slash pairing; me, I'm bored.

Oh, it's also really, really Republican: the leads are apparently subject to no ethical or procedural constraints on their ability to chase down and interrogate evil-doers.

Last edited 2011-04-22 01:16 am UTC

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sasha_feather: Teyla from Stargate: Atlantis (teyla)


[personal profile] sasha_feather
2011-04-22 01:21 am UTC (link)
Agreed!

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missyb: (Smirk)


[personal profile] missyb
2011-04-22 03:25 am UTC (link)
I do not recognize the two white dudes at all.

I do, however, recognize Grace Park from BSG and Daniel Dae-Kim from Angel. If TV and I spent a significant amount of time together, I'd probably watch for them. In particular, Grace Park was riveting in BSG.

(Daniel Dae-Kim was wonderful in Angel, but I will freely admit to being utterly fascinated by the planes and angles of his beautiful face, no matter what role he's playing.)

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glass_icarus: (vienna teng: stage lights)


[personal profile] glass_icarus
2011-04-22 04:01 pm UTC (link)
H50 is an off-and-on lurking fandom of mine- I couldn't get past the first two eps, but I did read some fic! It all featured Kono (with a little bit of Chin), and there was some adorably hot Kono/Danny, but I am predictably selective in terms of reading, aheh. Oh, and also [personal profile] leupagus has an AU H50 that recasts the team with all the female characters.

Not that this prevails against the larger fandom trends, but I am accustomed to clinging to tiny spaces with both hands, and I am kind of incredibly/embarrassingly/depressingly glad that they exist for me to clutch at in the first place.

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