Buffy 1x01, "Welcome to the Hellmouth"; 1x02, "The Harvest"

[kate_nepveu]

My contrarian determination never to watch an episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer was foiled by Chad's inviting Jennifer Ouellette, author of The Physics of the Buffyverse and another pop-science book, to speak at Union next week. Chad figured it would be good if he'd actually seen more than a half episode of Buffy here and there, so Netflix'ed the first two discs of Season One & borrowed Season Five from a pimping co-worker (who recommended episodes 5 & 12, FWIW). We watched the very first two episodes tonight.

I'd always said that I wasn't interested in Buffy because I didn't want to watch a show about high school, even the demons of high school literalized. I realize now that I forgot a much more salient objection:

I don't want to watch horror.

I realize to everyone else in the world, the things-that-go-bump (or boo) moments are very tame, but I react very badly to that kind of suspense, and just don't enjoy watching it. Which is actually a relief, because I was afraid I'd like it, and seven seasons of Buffy plus how many of Angel?, well, that's a really big time commitment.

Some specific comments about these two episodes, behind the cut. If you're going to spoil anything past these episodes, ROT13 it or enclose it in <span style="color: #999999; background-color: #999999"> </span>.

In no particular order:

• I liked that Buffy had already found out that she was a Slayer and was trying to ditch it. For some reason I expected the show to start with her discovery, but this was a lot more interesting.
• Willow is adorable.
• It's very weird watching the beginning when I have general ideas about what happens in the rest of the series from indiscriminately reading other people's spoiler comments.
• For instance, I'd never heard anyone talk about Jesse, so I was pretty sure he was toast. I don't know how it appeared to anyone watching for the first time.
• Though I think that Angel had big flashing "Warning! Major Character!" signs hanging all over him right from the start.
• Apparently Buffy's super-strength goes away when the plot requires it, because it should not have been that hard for her to shut the door underground after Jesse trapped them.
• Did your suburban hometown have a club where the teenagers hung out?
• And they're really sure that no-one ever goes in that library, huh? Did Giles put up an aversion spell or something?
• It's really hard to talk around spoilers for the rest of the show. I think I'll have to go suck down spoilers at Wikipedia or something.

ETA: Congratulations if you didn't find it scary. I did, I didn't enjoy it, you're not going to convince me otherwise.

Man, I knew this was going to happen if I posted this, but I thought my comments were sufficiently clear to avoid it.

ETA 2: See this conversation with pnh for an explanation of why I felt the previous ETA necessary.

ETA 3: Chad's comments.

Comments

[scifantasy.livejournal.com]

I liked that Buffy had already found out that she was a Slayer and was trying to ditch it.

I don't know if you know this backstory: Buffy the show in effect follows the original Whedon script for the movie--which the WB forced to change. So there's that.

Also--I don't know whether you can classify Buffy as horror. I don't recall many "boo!" moments.

[scifantasy.livejournal.com]

*shrug* I dunno. It always pushed my "fantasy" buttons more than "horror."

[cofax7]

Yup. Supernatural is horror; it's way more tension-and-gore-filled than Buffy. I was only ever metaphysically scared two or three times on the entire run of Buffy, and never had to look away from the screen. Okay, once I looked away from the screen.

[kate_nepveu]

. . . not that I was going to watch any more _Supernatural_ anyway, but now definitely not!

[kate_nepveu]

1) I may have and forgotten;

2) See ETA, please.

[scifantasy.livejournal.com]

1) OK.

2) Definitely put me in the pnh camp. Sorry.

[kate_nepveu]

Thanks.

[kate_nepveu]

I mean, putting "Hellmouth" up on a whiteboard on the first floor? In the second episode? That's some serious confidence.

Sorry, I don't intend to keep watching.

[desdenova.livejournal.com]

General, mild spoiler for later seasons/episodes of Buffy:

Over time, it becomes evident that the people of Sunnydale are not completely ignorant of all the creepy supernatural stuff that goes on; it's more like one of those thing you Don't Talk About.

It's a shame that the horror stuff is a dealbreaker, 'cause it is a very good show, but I understand. I have a similar issue with icky medical stuff which makes it impossible for me to watch things like House.

[kate_nepveu]

Thanks re: the spoiler.

(I can't watch _House_ because I have issues with misanthropes. => )

[calimac.livejournal.com]

I don't like horror either. I don't watch it and I don't even read it.

But I like Buffy. It just doesn't feel like horror to me. It's more suspense.

However, I didn't start watching in the first season, but in the third. The first season is a lot more conventional in style than what followed, and many people consider it not that good.

As the previous commenter implied, the TV show is intended as a sequel to (an idealized version of) the feature film. That's where Buffy learned she was the Slayer. I believe there's a quick flash through her previous life at one point in the first episode.

Joss Whedon, the creator, had wanted to put Jesse (the actor playing him, that is) in the opening credits, so as to fool viewers into not realizing that he's toast. But time and money prevented it. The main point is: he's not fooling around. Major changes will occur in this show.

My suggestion for anyone wanting to just sample the show would be a second season episode called "Lie To Me". But if you just want to jump in to later Buffy, the beginning of the 5th season might not be a bad place to try, for reasons that may or may not be clear after the first two episodes. I'll say no more.

[kate_nepveu]

1) See ETA, please.

2) I'll pass the sampling stuff along to Chad for his homework purposes.

[calimac.livejournal.com]

Well, OK, but I was perhaps trying to suggest that, the first season being more conventional in style than what follows, that if you found the opening episode scary that wouldn't necessarily apply to later Buffy. All I can say is that if I'd watched the first episode first, I might not have been much inspired to continue either.

If you were willing to sample more [please note that I've phrased that as a hypothetical conditional], there are a couple episodes later on that I'd be curious as to your reaction to, among them the second episode of the 5th season ("Real Me") in which the vampires, though evil and deadly, are played as comic relief.

Would a person who found "Welcome to the Hellmouth/The Harvest" too scary to continue find "Real Me" scary? I have no idea, but if I did have an idea it would be a useful data point for me, to help me in deciding whether a given person would like the show or not.

I'm not asking that you be a guinea pig here. I'm just explaining the motivation of my interest in the subject of your interest.

[pnh.livejournal.com]

I hate horror. I'm not wild about suspense. I love Buffy.

[kate_nepveu]

See ETA, please.

[pnh.livejournal.com]

Wasn't trying to convince you of anything, honest. Offered as data point only.

[kate_nepveu]

Okay. You can see how it could naturally be read otherwise, though?

[pnh.livejournal.com]

It's a common online communication snarl. You're (in this conversation) being very focused on precisely stating your attitudes and preferences. Other people aren't so much arguing with you, or telling you to change, as they're saying "Interesting. Now my feelings are the same in this way and different in that way..." In other words, they're taking off from what you said in order to talk about themselves. At times this can be FANTASTICALLY ANNOYING and make the original speaker feel comprehensively disagreed with. I've certainly been there.

[kate_nepveu]

Precisely. I try to phrase things as, "Huh. I felt (whatever). Sorry to hear it didn't work for you," just to make it explicit that I wasn't disputing the (anti-whatever).

(Especially since _Buffy_ fans are rabid in recommending their show. => )

[montoya.livejournal.com]

Man, NO KIDDING about the rabidness. It's why I hated the show so vehemently for so long before I came to think it was the second awesomest show of all time.

[montoya.livejournal.com]

(And I still hate Babylon 5 with a white-hot passion.)

[scifantasy.livejournal.com]

For that same reason?

[kate_nepveu]

What's the first awesomest?

[montoya.livejournal.com]

Firefly.

[calimac.livejournal.com]

borrowed Season Five from a pimping co-worker (who recommended episodes 5 & 12, FWIW)

I just noticed this. As a Buffy fan who tries to remain aware of what the show would look like to someone who doesn't know it, my strong advice is DO NOT just sample those episodes out of season 5. They're both heavily arc-oriented episodes whose emotional effect, or indeed comprehension, depend on your already knowing what's going on. People who do already know what's going on tend to forget this. Larding yourself with spoiler facts from the Internet will not help.

If you want to sample season 5, start with the first two episodes. They're both pretty straightforward in their way. Then get back to us here and tell us what you think and what you know about what's going on.

[kate_nepveu]

Thanks. I don't want to sample season 5, they were recommended to Chad for his homework purposes. I'll point this out to him.

[rachelmanija.livejournal.com]

Hmm. I think the pacing of most of season one and some of season two is not that great, but season three is one of my very favorite single seasons of TV ever.

I only ever found one episode scary, and that's in season four or five. ("Hush") It's also one of the best episodes, so if you make it that far I wouldn't recommend avoiding it.

[kate_nepveu]

See ETA, please.

[rachelmanija.livejournal.com]

Sorry, I was only speaking as to my own reaction.

[kate_nepveu]

Okay, thanks.

[avitzur.livejournal.com]

Whedon loves to play with the cliches and defy the viewers expectations. The first season is in some ways the weakest, as many of the episodes are of the basic Monster-of-the-Week variety. Later on the show develops a much richer texture with long story arcs and elements spanning multiple seasons. If I had to pigeonhole it into a genre, I'd say it's far closer to soap opera. The quality of individual episodes vary enormously, but when it hits its stride, it is hands down the best television has ever offered. Jennifer's book is one of dozens of books analyzing the show ranging from the frivolous to serious critical discourse. It is rare for television writing to have the intellectual depth to warrant the level of analysis and study Buffy has gotten.

[kate_nepveu]

Having watched _Firefly_, I'm definitely aware of Whedon's tendencies, and I can see some of them coming from my general knowledge of spoilers. Which is why I may go suck down spoilers for an intellectual appreciation of the arcs, removed from the tension that I don't enjoy.

[scifantasy.livejournal.com]

I may go suck down spoilers for an intellectual appreciation of the arcs, removed from the tension that I don't enjoy.

Interesting. I'd like to hear your thoughts on some of the arcs, if you do that. It would be interesting to hear how they sound to someone reading them on paper, as opposed to watching them.

Also, there's a fantastic website which contains much of the dialogue from the show: http://vrya.net/bdb/ That might help you get the tone or sense of certain episodes/scenes.

[kate_nepveu]

I doubt I'd post about it, but thanks.

[scifantasy.livejournal.com]

*shrug* Ah well. Enjoy, if you decide to, and if not, that's cool too.

[cofax7]

One of the things I love about Season 1, having just completed a year-long rewatch of the entire run of the show, is how many themes are raised in it that Whedon gets to revisit in more detail, with twists, later on. It's marvelous.

And season 1 is... cute. Fluffy. Everyone's young and perky, even Giles, although their wardrobes mostly improve over the course of the series (there are great cheers when Giles finally ditches the tweed).

[kate_nepveu]

Everyone _was_ awfully cute; knowing what happens with some characters, the cognitive dissonance was pretty severe.

I get very emotionally involved in stuff on screen, so as I said, these two episodes were too tense/scary for me, and darker stuff is *right up*, because I'm just not having any fun.

[kate_nepveu]

*right out*

I should not type comments before breakfast.

[readinggeek451]

I'm not much for horror, but the reason I have never (and will never) watched Buffy is that I cannot handle vampires. At all. Even "very mild" vampire stuff gives me the screaming-meemies and nightmares. It's a shame, too, because otherwise Buffy sounds right up my alley.

Note: this is a personal datapoint such as PNH describes, not intended to convince anyone of anything.

[kate_nepveu]

Yeah, that would be a pretty serious stumbling block! And they're *everwhere* (fictionally) these days, too.

[shati.livejournal.com]

(Here by way of yhlee.) A friend of mine has a similar reaction to Firefly; even episodes I don't see as primarily about fear/suspense make her way too jumpy to enjoy watching.

It's very weird watching the beginning when I have general ideas about what happens in the rest of the series from indiscriminately reading other people's spoiler comments.

Oh yes. For the most part it was more fun for me that way, though I regret having been spoiled for the second season of Buffy more than anything else ever. I enjoyed the cognitive dissonance. *g*

I went straight from the middle of the second season to the sixth season (stranger juxtapositions may not exist), and it took seeing how much Buffy changed for me to realize what Firefly's cancellation had meant. I'd thought it was a shame there wasn't more, but I hadn't dreamed that much could change.

[kate_nepveu]

. . . 'cuse me while I regret the cancellation of _Firefly_, again.

[corruptedjasper.livejournal.com]

Clearly, everybody who's not you knows much better than you whether you like something or not.

But seriously, you're totally right about the time-commitment. Season 1 isn't the best of the bunch, though, S2 and 3 are much better. But hey, if it's not your genre, it's not your genre. People have raved to me about Lost at length, but... Meh.

[kate_nepveu]

I gave up on _Lost_ halfway through season two and don't miss it at all, so really, Your Mileage, It Does Vary.